Pellet Fan
Pit Talk -- Comments and Questions Regarding These Pellet Pits => Dansons/Country Smokers...Louisana Grills...Pit Boss => Topic started by: Bar-B-Lew on May 09, 2018, 07:51:27 AM
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I finally fired up the Copperhead 5. It was fairly easy to rollout of the garage over the homemade ramps to get over the door threshold onto the patio. I had about 5# of uncooked jerky from my December cook that was in the freezer that I thawed and am using for my first cook. I want to use this unit for cooking jerky Memorial Day weekend.
Here is a pic of the initial startup. Lotsa thick smoke as you normally get with a startup. It settled down a few minutes afterward. Only took 10-15 minutes to get to about 300° when I had the controller set to 350° per startup instructions. I then set it to 150°. I filled the pan with about 60 ounces of water. The top racks where the meat is sitting is running at about 120° so far. the bottom rack that is about half way up the cabinet with nothing on it is running about 140°-145°. I am using my Smoke to monitor temps from my basement while I work today.
I really need some more racks. I was told via an email from Pit Boss that they should have them online in May/June.
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/951/41275331544_fc8b03a286_z.jpg)
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/955/41949768172_5fbb9518ab_z.jpg)
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I may have to get one of these as a dedicated cold smoker. Look forward to your results.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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The unit looks like it is running about a 10°-15° up and down temp swing. Top shelf is running 110°-125° and bottom shelf (again, mid way up the unit) is running 135°-145°. This is with controller set at 150° and initially about 60 ounces of water in the pan. Temp outside is 57° with almost no wind. I am using the Thermoworks Smoke temp probes on top shelf and bottom shelf to monitor temps. I didn't have time to get the Gateway hooked up to graph. May do that one of these weekends.
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131° top side temp on top shelf
157° top side temp on lowest shelf
This is about 75 minutes into the cook.
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I never considered cutting the jerky up early, marinating it and then freezing it for a future smoke. That will be on my list to do real soon.
As far as more racks are concerned, I ordered something online a couple days ago that is supposed to arrive today. Once it gets here I'll show you what I am doing.
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I never considered cutting the jerky up early, marinating it and then freezing it for a future smoke. That will be on my list to do real soon.
As far as more racks are concerned, I ordered something online a couple days ago that is supposed to arrive today. Once it gets here I'll show you what I am doing.
Well, the freezing was not necessarily planned. We had too much to drink and had all racks on all grills loaded with jerky and decided to freeze what was left. We made about 50# of uncooked meat that day and had about 5# leftover. Most of it was small pieces so I am not expecting much from this batch.
The next batch will go thru my LEM jerky slicer attachment to the meat grinder.
Looking forward to your rack update.
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146° top side temp on top shelf
180° top side temp on lowest shelf
This is about 90 minutes into the cook.
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Very informative + nice pics.
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I opened the door about 20 minutes ago to check on the jerky. The temps dropped about 20°-25°, but recovered in a few minutes. Still a lot of water in the pan and it was in the steaming state.
Racks are now at about 130° and 170° 20 minutes after door was opened.
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If you want to cool it off could you siphon some water out of the pan and throw some ice in it. That is my plan when I smoke jerky.
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If you want to cool it off could you siphon some water out of the pan and throw some ice in it. That is my plan when I smoke jerky.
I'm good with it where it is right now. My MAK and Memphis usually run at 170°-180° when I make jerky so this is lower. I am slightly concerned that the water may slow it from drying out. If it is not done in 4 hours, I will throw it in my dehydrator for a bit. I want to test that method anyway so that we can make more jerky during the same period of time.
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I had a look at the Copperhead 5 video on the Pit Boss site. Looks like a nice unit..Pricing was well below what I thought it to be... I was wondering how the "see through" function of the door will hold up..
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If you want to cool it off could you siphon some water out of the pan and throw some ice in it. That is my plan when I smoke jerky.
I'm good with it where it is right now. My MAK and Memphis usually run at 170°-180° when I make jerky so this is lower. I am slightly concerned that the water may slow it from drying out. If it is not done in 4 hours, I will throw it in my dehydrator for a bit. I want to test that method anyway so that we can make more jerky during the same period of time.
If you take 2 identical pans of water and put one on your range and start it boiling and leave the other on the counter. The one on the range will evaporate much, much faster than the one on the counter. If you keep the water in the drip pan from from boiling / steaming, you will get a lot less moisture in the cooking cabinet. At least that is my thought process.
I have heard more than 1 person say that when they have cooked on a rainy day, they feel the meat takes on more smoke flavor. More humid air may actually enhance the smoke flavor, except for the fact the humidity from the drip pan is being added after the fire and not going through the fire. It is not exactly the same.
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According to Bentley, the see thru door needs to be cleaned about every other cook.
I pulled the jerky off the smoker after 3 hours and put into my dehydrator. This is an experiment I want to try to see if we can get smoke and then a better dry in the dehydrator. Will also give us more capacity for cooking more meat in one day.
The unit settled in for 60+ minutes with controller at 150°. You can see the bottom probe. The other probe is in the top rack. You can see the temps on the smoke versus the controller setting.
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/903/41278097764_b0c380b9fc_z.jpg)
3 hours at 150° controller setting. These are from the 3rd rack down from the top. I should have taken pics of the other two racks above it. They were not as cooked/dryed.
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/979/28125407008_5a6e681a01_z.jpg)
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If you want to cool it off could you siphon some water out of the pan and throw some ice in it. That is my plan when I smoke jerky.
I'm good with it where it is right now. My MAK and Memphis usually run at 170°-180° when I make jerky so this is lower. I am slightly concerned that the water may slow it from drying out. If it is not done in 4 hours, I will throw it in my dehydrator for a bit. I want to test that method anyway so that we can make more jerky during the same period of time.
If you take 2 identical pans of water and put one on your range and start it boiling and leave the other on the counter. The one on the range will evaporate much, much faster than the one on the counter. If you keep the water in the drip pan from from boiling / steaming, you will get a lot less moisture in the cooking cabinet. At least that is my thought process.
I'm not sure it needs the water in the unit. I will do another test with the unit set at 150° without the water in the pan. This is fun to learn a new pit. Once I figure out how to dial it in, then it usually becomes sorta set and forget on my other units.
BTW, I was using Cabella's cherry pellets for those wandering.
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I don't have a dehydrator. When I used my Traeger Lil Tex with the Savannah Stoker controller, I smoked my jerky between 145 and 160 for 6-8 hours, just above the food safety danger zone, to dry it out. It was impossible to do if the temperature was above 70-ish. I am looking forward to trying to duplicate that with my Copperhead 5 on much warmer days, here in South Texas. Bentley put a full size pan with ice on the bottom shelf and it lowered the cooking chamber temperatures quite a bit. Throwing some ice in the drip pan should accomplish similar results without losing the use of the lowest shelf and without adding much humidity, as long as the water does not begin to boil. I guess that is why I keep going back to putting ice in the drip pan. I think it is something I will need to do. Lord knows there is no 1 perfect way to do just about anything. In any case, I hope your jerky turns out just the way you like it. Let us know how it turns out.
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Yes, I noticed how much of an impact the ice had on lowering the temps in the cabinet. That is a great solution to getting really low temps where you could probably cold smoke cheese in the unit on the smoke setting with a pan of ice in it. I am sure I will do that at some point.
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I have not eaten any yet, but it looks about how I like to cook it. 3 hours in the Pit Boss and 3 hours in the Cabela's 10 tray dehydrator at 160°. I wasn't expecting much considering this was bits and pieces from a prior cook that were not used at that time. Before I taste it, I am happy with the results so far. This is 4 of the 6 trays. I know some of this is venison, but there may be some beef too. I don't remember. I don't even know what the flavors of the marinade/cure were. I am going to just mix them all together for pot luck jerky bags.
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/831/42000098251_13f4fa7c66_h.jpg)
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Looks great, doing mine tomorrow.
On a side note if there is anyone considering buying one Cabelas has the 7 on sale now for 449.
https://www.cabelas.com/product/PIT-BOSS-SERIES-PELLET-SMOKER/2614913.uts?slotId=1
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Looks great, doing mine tomorrow.
On a side note if there is anyone considering buying one Cabelas has the 7 on sale now for 449.
https://www.cabelas.com/product/PIT-BOSS-SERIES-PELLET-SMOKER/2614913.uts?slotId=1
Wow! Great price!
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Looks great!
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Looks great!
Thanks, but I can't wait to try the jerky slicer to get more consistent cut and it will be 1/4" thick. It will make it easier to put on the trays and will be more uniform when cooked.
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what jerky slicer did you get?
I have a hand crank one and one that mounts to the grinder motor, most of the time I just slice by hand, I need to get a better knife though
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what jerky slicer did you get?
I have a hand crank one and one that mounts to the grinder motor, most of the time I just slice by hand, I need to get a better knife though
I bought the LEM one to go onto the head of my LEM meat grinder. Have not had a chance to use either yet.
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what jerky slicer did you get?
I have a hand crank one and one that mounts to the grinder motor, most of the time I just slice by hand, I need to get a better knife though
I bought the LEM one to go onto the head of my LEM meat grinder. Have not had a chance to use either yet.
The patience of Job is strong with this one. May the LEM be with you.
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Similar to the one I have for the Cabelas motor. It worked well, but you still had to cut the meat to fit The nice thing with it was the top round london broils would usually go right into it. Mine did not like any type of silver skin or anything like that.
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Similar to the one I have for the Cabelas motor. It worked well, but you still had to cut the meat to fit The nice thing with it was the top round london broils would usually go right into it. Mine did not like any type of silver skin or anything like that.
Was the thickness consistent after coming through the slicer? That is what I am expecting.
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40% yield
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/954/42015944481_d258c994de_c.jpg)
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Nice post. Good info!
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How long does home made jerky stay edible vs buying store bought jerky?
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How long does home made jerky stay edible vs buying store bought jerky?
It really depends on whether you use cure or not. Without cure, a week or so in the refrigerator is my rule of thumb. It will last longer, before spoiling, if you use cure but I am not familiar with using cure. Because I do not use cure I usually toss my jerky in the freezer a couple days after I make it. Mine usually has very little moisture in it so it does not taste frozen when I grab a piece from the freezer and eat it. It is always eaten within a month or so.
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I put it in the fridge after cooking yesterday. I then vac sealed it today and put back in the fridge. Whatever I don't eat in a week, I put in the freezer. I have a cure, but still kinda abide by it not being cured. It can last in the freezer for 6-12 months vac sealed if not longer.
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Looking forward to your rack update.
This is what I ended up with. The hooks I bought were pegboard hooks from McMaster-Carr, part number 18535A83. They are zinc coated but when I looked around I found you can soak them in regular white vinegar for 48 hours to remove the zinc coating and be left with bare metal. You could do the same with muriatic acid for a few hours but I had the white vinegar on hand and time to spare so I went in that direction. I also felt the vinegar was just safer to handle. So I tried it and it appears to have worked out great. The hole spacing of the extra peg on the back did not fit with the hole spacing in the Copperhead 5, and I knew that going in so I removed the lower peg with an angle grinder, after removing the zinc. As for the shelves, well I had, actually still have, the shelf system I had built for my Traeger Lil Tex and the shelves are exactly the same size as the ones the Copperhead 5 uses. So the shelves are just being re-appropriated from the Traeger shelf system, and are essentially free in my case. All said and done it cost me, $20, maybe 1.5 hours of time and some shelves I already had on hand to almost double the capacity for Jerky cooking. 9 Shelves in total spaced 2.25" to 2.75" and there is room to add another at the bottom but I think that will be too close to the drip pan. I am happy with the way it turned out.
Edit Below:
The last picture is of the shelf system I had in my Traeger. It was to long front to back to put in the Copperhead 5.
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Thank you for the great tip for folks!
And folks wonder why I don't like an Eastern Carolina BBQ sauce... :pig:
They are zinc coated but when I looked around I found you can soak them in regular white vinegar for 48 hours to remove the zinc coating and be left with bare metal.
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Thank you for the great tip for folks!
All of my best ideas, I "borrow" from others. I borrowed the remove zinc idea from this guy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xH2A7Alt-LU
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Will have to see if I can find some racks now as those hooks look easy enough to deal with. If Pit Boss is too expensive or takes to long to get their supplies for sale on line, I may go with this idea. Do you remember where you bought the grates from?
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Will have to see if I can find some racks now as those hooks look easy enough to deal with. If Pit Boss is too expensive or takes to long to get their supplies for sale on line, I may go with this idea. Do you remember where you bought the grates from?
Home Depot, back in 2011-ish. They were a replacement grate for a Charbroil grill if I recall correctly. If I recall they were actually a few inches longer, side to side, but the way they were built made it easy to use bolt cutters and shorten them without losing any of their integrity. Front to back they just happen to match the Copperhead 5 racks exactly. I can take a picture of a rack if you wish.
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Will have to see if I can find some racks now as those hooks look easy enough to deal with. If Pit Boss is too expensive or takes to long to get their supplies for sale on line, I may go with this idea. Do you remember where you bought the grates from?
Home Depot, back in 2011-ish. They were a replacement grate for a Charbroil grill if I recall correctly. If I recall they were actually a few inches longer, side to side, but the way they were built made it easy to use bolt cutters and shorten them without losing any of their integrity. Front to back they just happen to match the Copperhead 5 racks exactly. I can take a picture of a rack if you wish.
Picture would be great.
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Picture would be great.
They measure 13.75" X 21.75". I was just looking and they appear to be a replacement for the Charbroil 7000 series grill, which I used bolt cutters to cut to width.
Notice how the rungs (3rd from the top is the most visible) aren't even straight? That is not because of the angle of the camera. That is a high quality item right there... ;)
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Nice job!!
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Just a FYI - Cure doesn't really make jerky shelf stable. Cure is really only used for protection from nasty stuff growing while it's being smoked.
If you want shelf stable jerky you have to reduce the ' water activity ' , to a level where stuff won't grow.
I'm by no means an expert on this, in fact, I can't really wrap my head around 'water activity' yet... but for me, I never consider my jerky to be shelf stable. I've taken some with me on road trips before loose in ziplock bags, without refrigeration for a few days and haven't died yet from doing that. For the most part I keep mine refrigerated
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I keep it frozen or refrigerated. It is pretty obvious to tell when it is no good anymore...it gets a little fuzzy. I have only had that happen when it was left unrefrigerated.
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Just a FYI - Cure doesn't really make jerky shelf stable. Cure is really only used for protection from nasty stuff growing while it's being smoked.
If you want shelf stable jerky you have to reduce the ' water activity ' , to a level where stuff won't grow.
I'm by no means an expert on this, in fact, I can't really wrap my head around 'water activity' yet... but for me, I never consider my jerky to be shelf stable. I've taken some with me on road trips before loose in ziplock bags, without refrigeration for a few days and haven't died yet from doing that. For the most part I keep mine refrigerated
You made me look deeper into this and I really appreciate it. The USDA actually has a detailed guide line for making jerky at home. They suggest bringing the meat up to 160 degrees before you start the drying process. I was not aware of this. My jerky cooks will now begin with a couple hours at 180 to start and then I will drop it down to a lower temperature for the duration. Thank you!
https://www.fsis.usda.gov/wps/portal/fsis/topics/food-safety-education/get-answers/food-safety-fact-sheets/meat-preparation/jerky-and-food-safety/CT_Index
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Just a FYI - Cure doesn't really make jerky shelf stable. Cure is really only used for protection from nasty stuff growing while it's being smoked.
If you want shelf stable jerky you have to reduce the ' water activity ' , to a level where stuff won't grow.
I'm by no means an expert on this, in fact, I can't really wrap my head around 'water activity' yet... but for me, I never consider my jerky to be shelf stable. I've taken some with me on road trips before loose in ziplock bags, without refrigeration for a few days and haven't died yet from doing that. For the most part I keep mine refrigerated
You made me look deeper into this and I really appreciate it. The USDA actually has a detailed guide line for making jerky at home. They suggest bringing the meat up to 160 degrees before you start the drying process. I was not aware of this. My jerky cooks will now begin with a couple hours at 180 to start and then I will drop it down to a lower temperature for the duration. Thank you!
https://www.fsis.usda.gov/wps/portal/fsis/topics/food-safety-education/get-answers/food-safety-fact-sheets/meat-preparation/jerky-and-food-safety/CT_Index
I tried that once in the oven and then going to the dehydrator. Worst jerky I made. Threw it out.
I guess I am taking risks then. I pull the jerky right out of the wet marinade/cure it has been in for usually 12-24 hours, onto frog mats, sprinkle with dry rub, and into the smoker at 150°-180° depending on the smoker I am using. Smoke for 2-3 hours and then into dehydrator for 2-3 hours at 160°.
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I would think starting the process at 180, a temperature you use anyway, for a couple hours would get the meat to an internal temp of 160 soon enough, before it starts drying out. I am not going to use the oven at all. After a couple hours at 180, I will drop the temp to something in the 150 range to finish off the drying out process. I am also considering sous vide at 160 for 30 minutes before putting them on the frog mats. I might do a little of both and see which one turns out better results.
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May just cook at 160° at minimum on Copperhead when I get it back up and running.
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Ah... I don't follow the USDA on jerky. Thankfully I don't plan on selling any.
I have started to use cure #1 again in my process even though I don't think it's that important for my methods. I mainly do it because I have it on hand and think there's some reduced risk during the smoking process. It also keeps the meat pink inside rather than turning gray.
Technically the cure helps keep things safer before the meat should ever get up to 140F. (While it's in the 'danger zone', if you where to smoke at 120F or so, it'd be more important. In theory even cooking at 160F could leave the meat surface bellow 140F do to evaporative cooling. Anyway I don't really worry about it myself, but I am aware of some risk, I'm willing to risk it anyway.
But it still doesn't make a shelf stable product my way.
I've been making jerky for 25 years now, ain't dead yet.
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I also have read that if you cook meat at a lower them than USDA guidelines for an extended period of time that it serves the same purpose as USDA guidelines. I don't remember the specifics. I like the results of my method and will roll with the chances like LSJ.
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They keep emphasizing, "especially ground beef". The studies they reference are all talking about ground beef made into jerky and then it appears they (the USDA) make the leap to all jerky on their own. At least that is the way I interpreted their references to the studies. The more I read it, the more I get the impression that it is more necessary with ground beef made into jerky, where the pathogens are throughout the meat, as opposed to just on the surface. The way I look at it, the strips I make into jerky are really thin strips of steak, and it is much less likely for the pathogens to get to the middle of the strips I cut. They are on the surfaces, and for the most part if I get the surface to 160, I feel I am good. This won't really change my method much either, mainly because I do not use ground meat to make jerky.
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I remember when I bought the cabelas dehydrator, it had a turkey jerky recipe that they wanted cooked in the oven for so long before putting in to dry. It was messy and tasted horrible.
I use cure always, I have jerky on the counter in a lock n lock container for 2 months with no issues, other than I had some ground meat that had dried more and got really hard, so I tossed a slice of bread in for a day.