Pellet Fan
Pit Talk -- Comments and Questions Regarding These Pellet Pits => recteq => Topic started by: okie smokie on July 31, 2022, 06:00:50 PM
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Has anyone purchased the new RT 1070? Seems like there are not legitimate review. Couple of promotional videos. I was very pleased with the 590. Pros? Cons?
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What are you going to do with your Beale St?
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I see people on FB not the happiest with build fit and finish. There are some that get water in and they can't figure out where it comes in. The one guy had a cover made I believe because RT doesn't have one for a built in.
For me the way they mount the controller just makes it look off, looks like a 5th grader built it.But then they mount all their controllers like this.
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What are you going to do with your Beale St?
All depends on whether they will send me a new control to install. If so and temps are acceptable, I will not purchase the 1070 (or other).
If there is no change, I will conclude that the control is flawed in design or that they went cheap on the wrong thing.
Think about this: Here is a company that advertises how much better their temps are controlled for good cooking. I'm sure that the Elite and Pro are very stable in that respect. Then they produce a significantly cheaper model to compete with the upper mid price market, and in doing so, use a lesser quality control module, or the programmed algorithms are not proper. I can't believe they did so. So it should be resolved with a new good control. If not, then I will take the loss and purchase another pit. I am waiting for a reply from Arni in Service. I am becoming less tolerant of the delay and will decide soon. Too old to fuss and fume. What do you suggest?
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I have read your posts on your quest for excellence. I may need to go back and re read some to see the temp issues.
Curious what is your expectation of the temps and the the differences in different spots on the grill or over all temp fluctuations.
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I was looking at the RT1070 too.
Having the burn pot outside the grill is a double-edged sword. East to clean, but all that heat coming off the sides is wasted.
I think temp only goes to 450 too, fine for BBQ but could be too low for other things.
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I am fully aware of the range of fluctuations that occur with both the older controls and PID.
1. variations in temp distribution on the grates: I am not talking about that at all. In fact the BS has a more symmetrical distribution and has less temp difference on left, center, and right than any grill I have tested. Traeger Lil Tex, Blaz'n, or Recteq. At low temps I found only 18* less on left, and 16* less on right than the center temp. I credit symmetry of design for that. No complaint there.
2. I am talking about what you "set" and what you really get from the control. Example: I set it at 225* and it will overshoot to 300* and then drift down to 225* and stay there most of the time. These are temps on the control window. However, with my Square Dot certified oven probe in the middle of the grates, the temp is never stable and averages 249* the first hour. The temp on the square D then gradually climbs up to 274*+- (not averaged) during the second hour, with occasional drops to around 208, and then back up to 270 range. All of this time the temp on the smoker control is almost always on 225* (where I set it) and does not very except a degree on two either way. This gives the impression of good control. Meanwhile the real temp is all over the place, and averaging higher each hour. When the control reads 225/225 and the actual is 274 in the middle (256 on left, 274 middle and 254 on right), that is not acceptable fluctuation.
It is known that temps show more variation with low/slow settings (fan going off and on). In fact, CampChef explains this in their own advertising of their new PID control on the Woodwind. But the temps should average out at the "set" temp. That does not happen on the Beale Street. On a 90* day, the fan is off for almost all the time when on a "smoke" setting. I mean less than 30 seconds of fan time for and hour at 225*. I think this is the culprit in my case. There is no "convection" when the fan is off and heat builds up as the ash pile grows in the fire pot. Again, CampChef advises that the temps will be higher during these swings but will even out (see their ad) on their machine. This does not happen in my BS.
3. Each time I have tested, the results are similar but different. High temp tests are also all over the place and vary with each repeat.
4. Conclusion: Bad control?????? BS control is NOT ITC3! It is ITC by name but not 3. They are vague in the ads. Also, It looks different as well. Also, I note that there are almost no objective test results on any platform I have seen.
5. The only low/slow cooks i have done are ribs and a tri tip. Have had to shorten the cook time on all, and I did get overdone ribs twice even tho I tried to avoid it. The trip tip was fine because I used my Meater Probe but the time was short.
Sorry for the windy review Dave, but this is what you asked for. My apologies for taking up too much space.
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I was looking at the RT1070 too.
Having the burn pot outside the grill is a double-edged sword. East to clean, but all that heat coming off the sides is wasted.
I think temp only goes to 450 too, fine for BBQ but could be too low for other things.
Not sure about position of fire pot, but the temps you quote are not correct. 1070 is rated at 700* on HIGH. It has the 3 rpm auger motor, as the 590 now has.
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I was looking at the RT1070 too.
Having the burn pot outside the grill is a double-edged sword. East to clean, but all that heat coming off the sides is wasted.
I think temp only goes to 450 too, fine for BBQ but could be too low for other things.
Not sure about position of fire pot, but the temps you quote are not correct. 1070 is rated at 700* on HIGH. It has the 3 rpm auger motor, as the 590 now has.
My bad, maybe I got it confused with a different one. I have been looking at a lot lately.
EDIT: Yeah, I was thinking of a different grill. sorry about that.
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Okie, do you have the same issues if you have temp set at 275°? I use that temp for almost all smoking.
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Okie, do you have the same issues if you have temp set at 275°? I use that temp for almost all smoking.
I have not tested at that temp. Good News: I have been again told that the algorithm they use is based on six simultaneous probes placed 1 inch above the grates in various places, and that those temps are averaged. He implied that the results of the test we took at 180, 350, and 550 were all within spec, although I had to repeat the 180 a second time. Of course he had no knowledge of the actual temps that I acquired on the grates. Nonetheless, he is willing to send me another control, just to prove his point and satisfy my wishes to do so. I will have my probes set up left, center, right at the same time. If again control temps are within spec, but my probes show an improved "real" response as well I will be vindicated and keep the new control. If otherwise, I will capitulate and withdraw from the arena. (a wiser and poorer man). If the latter, I will have to decide to either live with it or consider another pit. Stay tuned, and thanks for the interest.
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I am fully aware of the range of fluctuations that occur with both the older controls and PID.
1. variations in temp distribution on the grates: I am not talking about that at all. In fact the BS has a more symmetrical distribution and has less temp difference on left, center, and right than any grill I have tested. Traeger Lil Tex, Blaz'n, or Recteq. At low temps I found only 18* less on left, and 16* less on right than the center temp. I credit symmetry of design for that. No complaint there.
2. I am talking about what you "set" and what you really get from the control. Example: I set it at 225* and it will overshoot to 300* and then drift down to 225* and stay there most of the time. These are temps on the control window. However, with my Square Dot certified oven probe in the middle of the grates, the temp is never stable and averages 249* the first hour. The temp on the square D then gradually climbs up to 274*+- (not averaged) during the second hour, with occasional drops to around 208, and then back up to 270 range. All of this time the temp on the smoker control is almost always on 225* (where I set it) and does not very except a degree on two either way. This gives the impression of good control. Meanwhile the real temp is all over the place, and averaging higher each hour. When the control reads 225/225 and the actual is 274 in the middle (256 on left, 274 middle and 254 on right), that is not acceptable fluctuation.
It is known that temps show more variation with low/slow settings (fan going off and on). In fact, CampChef explains this in their own advertising of their new PID control on the Woodwind. But the temps should average out at the "set" temp. That does not happen on the Beale Street. On a 90* day, the fan is off for almost all the time when on a "smoke" setting. I mean less than 30 seconds of fan time for and hour at 225*. I think this is the culprit in my case. There is no "convection" when the fan is off and heat builds up as the ash pile grows in the fire pot. Again, CampChef advises that the temps will be higher during these swings but will even out (see their ad) on their machine. This does not happen in my BS.
3. Each time I have tested, the results are similar but different. High temp tests are also all over the place and vary with each repeat.
4. Conclusion: Bad control?????? BS control is NOT ITC3! It is ITC by name but not 3. They are vague in the ads. Also, It looks different as well. Also, I note that there are almost no objective test results on any platform I have seen.
5. The only low/slow cooks i have done are ribs and a tri tip. Have had to shorten the cook time on all, and I did get overdone ribs twice even tho I tried to avoid it. The trip tip was fine because I used my Meater Probe but the time was short.
Sorry for the windy review Dave, but this is what you asked for. My apologies for taking up too much space.
You are good, I was just curious as to what you were looking for. I have not tested temps on anything since the RECTEC, after that and hearing holds temps with in 2° and seeing what it actually was. I gave up on temp testing the new cookers I bought. Add to that once you add in product of different shapes and sizes that in itself will throw temps off in spots so you really have no way of getting accurate temp readings. Also we know air is not a good conductor of heat, adding in a few big pieces of meat or something in a pan that will be cooking off moisture and helping hold temps once things get warmed up.
Not arguing, only giving my thinking on it. You have done more testing and know what your conditions are better than I. As I said I tested the RT and gave up. I know my gmg cooks hotter the pit boss I have no idea, because of the size I am thinking it may be lower.
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Just FYI here is a pic of the test I ran at 210* for a couple of hours. Now how can you have 210/210 on the control (the bottom is what you set and the upper is what you now measure (or is the average of the six probe sampling they use to make the algorithm) and have a current average temp of 274* with no low swings below 200*, (The square dot gives me 15 minute averages when it is set on Average.)
I was just using the new square dot on this run. Please understand that the 274 shown was the average of the previous 15 minutes, so temps must have been higher during part of that time unless it had been 274 for the whole 15 minutes. Either way not good.
By the way I tested my RT 590 when breaking it in and although it had hot and cold spots across the grates, the center temp was right on +- 3 degrees and stayed steady throughout the test without any wild swings. And when temp was set it did not overshoot by 70* to 100* at the beginning, and take 20-30 minutes to stabilize as the BS does. Crazy!
Soon I will have a new control to check all this out. So stay tuned till then.
(https://i.imgur.com/5J5ZQJdl.jpg)
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There’s only one pit probe in the grill, right? I kinda feel like they were pulling your leg about the average of six. Maybe testing the determined the best location from 6 choices? Regardless, if there’s only one pit probe, that’s all they can read from and go by in the wild. There’s no way to average something that’s not there. Anyway, I haven’t read every detail, but have you put a probe within say half an inch of where the BS pit probe is to see if it is reading accurately?
From afar, hearing you talk about 30 seconds of fan for an hour of burning sounds like a controller or logic problem.
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The 3 RPM auger that RecTeq is using in a few models is fantastic. Rumor is that the 700 has now been upgraded with the higher RPM auger, new controller, and cast iron deflector from the 1250. I'm not sure what all is in the 1070, but if the form factor works for you and you like the slot exhaust instead of a chimney then the 1070 should be great. I love my 1250.
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Looks like the same controller I have.
As it is impossible to have the set and actual the same 100% of the time, I'm sure they do some type of time averaging to keep actual close to set.
I do see mine fluctuate from time to time, but normally not by more than a degree or two.
Even the Savannah Stoker controller on my CampChef keeps the temps fairly close, and I know for certain there are swings in it.
The averaging keeps the unknowing customer happy, and avoids the calls they would get to customer service about the swings if it didn't have the averaging.
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There’s only one pit probe in the grill, right? I kinda feel like they were pulling your leg about the average of six. Maybe testing the determined the best location from 6 choices? Regardless, if there’s only one pit probe, that’s all they can read from and go by in the wild. There’s no way to average something that’s not there. Anyway, I haven’t read every detail, but have you put a probe within say half an inch of where the BS pit probe is to see if it is reading accurately?
From afar, hearing you talk about 30 seconds of fan for an hour of burning sounds like a controller or logic problem.
The "one probe" only happened when I received the Square Dot--to test it out. The other tests were with 3 probes, left center, middle center and right center each time. The RTD is a new replacement that was sent to me after the grease fire on my first cook. As for the "problem", I agree with you that it is a controller or logic problem. That is what I hope to prove with the new? control that Memphis is sending.
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Looks like the same controller I have.
As it is impossible to have the set and actual the same 100% of the time, I'm sure they do some type of time averaging to keep actual close to set.
I do see mine fluctuate from time to time, but normally not by more than a degree or two.
Even the Savannah Stoker controller on my CampChef keeps the temps fairly close, and I know for certain there are swings in it.
The averaging keeps the unknowing customer happy, and avoids the calls they would get to customer service about the swings if it didn't have the averaging.
Yes, they say it is averaged, that's how it should work. I think my control just interprets the temp incorrectly and reacts incorrectly. As they say in computer talk "garbage in, garbage out".
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Getting back to the 1070, I just spoke to RT tech and asked some general questions. The 1070 body is 430 SS, The fire pot, drip tray, and grates are all 304 SS. The main difference between the 590 and 1070 structurally, is that the auger tube and fire pot are below the barrel in the 1070, whereas they are in the barrel on the 590. Which allowed them to make the narrower hopper deep enough to hold 30 lbs of pellets. Good idea anyhow, as top of the fire pot is flush? (not sure about that) with the floor of the barrel. He said that there was really not heat loss from this position. (I guess because the fan blows the heat upward). The 700 has the tube and fire pot above the barrel floor.
Also, the 1070 body SS is 16 gauge. While the Memphis BS body is only 18 gauge! (Memphis is mostly double walled however).
Just FYI.
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Control issues discussed on my BS thread from this point, as that is where it was brought to light.
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Meanwhile, new 1070 ordered with the cover as well. I also have my GrillGrates from the 590 which I will clean up and use for searing. (upside down). I was told that the PID control has only been changed to accommodate the new 3 rpm auger which replaced the slower previous auger. New auger increases top temp to 700* instead of previous 600*. IMO 600* was enough to get good searing with GG's. Anxious to get back to reliable low/slow cooking.
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I forget what took you away from RT last time?
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I forget what took you away from RT last time?
Thought I was upgrading and also to have open flame option. Turns out the open flame gadget on the Beale Street requires time off for the steaks while you heat it up and change the flavorizer for the flamerize gadget. So I was able to achieve good sear with GG at 550*without the flame gadget. And as you know the BS was not an upgrade after all because of poor low/slow temp control. What I did not comment on is that the BS was also a disappointment as far as gauge and quality of the 430SS. Like it was built out of tin can material. I noted as I removed the side shelves that there were rust spots where the metal contacted metal and also where there were food drippings that I had failed to remove early. No excuse. For that price they should have delivered a sturdier structure and better grade of 430. I think Memphis took advantage of their reputation and produced a poor unit. If you can find any significant number of good actual BS owner reviews on the web, I would be surprised. (I don't believe the marketing reviews). My old RT590 SS was thicker and no external rust after 2.5 years.
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Marketing is the key to sales. you really have to look no further than RECTEC. they make nothing but money. The factory in China builds for them, they buy predesigned cookers like the 590 and then have the company that build change specs to what they want. Even the first one the 680 was based on the Treager Texas as far as dimensions. And there was a company in Germany I believe that was selling a cooker identical to the 680 before RT started selling them.
Not saying it is a bad thing, money is money, marketing and censored ratings are just parts of it all, no matter the brand.
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Marketing is the key to sales. you really have to look no further than RECTEC. they make nothing but money. The factory in China builds for them, they buy predesigned cookers like the 590 and then have the company that build change specs to what they want. Even the first one the 680 was based on the Treager Texas as far as dimensions. And there was a company in Germany I believe that was selling a cooker identical to the 680 before RT started selling them.
Not saying it is a bad thing, money is money, marketing and censored ratings are just parts of it all, no matter the brand.
I don't care who makes them(I would rather it not be China), its the end result that counts. The RT590 is the best I've seen. I bought two more for my kids, and they have cooked continuously for the past 3 years, with no complaints. One keeps his clean inside and out and one ignores that kind of attention and turns out great cooks. Like I said, I should have kept mine. The new model has a cast iron deflector replacing the old warping kind, a higher speed auger for higher temps, and the 1070 is an upgraded version.
I was surprised that there are scarce customer reviews of the BS. After all it has been out for about 3-4 years now. The only true consumer review I saw was for 3 units. Two were strong positive and one was very bad. Kinda like "don't criticize the sacred cow". Kind of reminds me of the Porsche 944.
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I’m Still having the same issue
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There’s only one pit probe in the grill, right? I kinda feel like they were pulling your leg about the average of six. Maybe testing the determined the best location from 6 choices? Regardless, if there’s only one pit probe, that’s all they can read from and go by in the wild. There’s no way to average something that’s not there. Anyway, I haven’t read every detail, but have you put a probe within say half an inch of where the BS pit probe is to see if it is reading accurately?
From afar, hearing you talk about 30 seconds of fan for an hour of burning sounds like a controller or logic problem.
The "SIX PROBES "were used in the DEVELOPMENT of the Memphis controllers to acquire an average. That goes back a long way.