I just got the first dose of Moderna in my home...not planning on making any changes to my routine...I have rarely worn a mask...only when medical people weren't comformtable with me not having one in their presence...I hang around with a lot of homeless in my neighborhood...YAY Portland!  Pfffbbbt!

  Portland does have some issues.  Hope they get them figured out.

Thank you.

Looks like you got some help.  I got as far as Sallings group and life and work decided I was too idle and swamped me.  Lots of info on the internet, you just have to weed through the garbage. 

My daughter age 49 gets her vax next week, and my son-in-law 51 got his first today. Tulsa is ahead of schedule.  Still wearing masks this week but who knows next week?  I and my wife had ours in Jan.

The Danish study in the Annals of Internal Medicine did not test what has been identified as the major benefit of mask wearing, which is to prevent the infected person from infecting others. It has been reported from early on that masks are primarily to prevent the spread from the mask wearers to others, with a possible small reduction in infection rates to the wearer. The nature of the Danish research is preliminary. Controls were the best they could impose and adherence to test protocols by participants was marginal.

While it is great to drill into this stuff, you have to realize that the folks that really understand the whole body of literature (rather than what you can easily get access to on the internet), in addition to, in-work research projects and clinical trials, are folks at organizations like the CDC. Our knowledge is going to expand over time, but that is what it takes to figure out something like this. In the meantime, we have to decide whether we are going to follow CDC direction, because masks might work, or try hard to find a justification for not following CDC guidance, because we don't want to wear masks.

In science it is body of work that counts. There are frequently competing theories. Making definitive conclusions before the research converges to a common understanding can be a problem. That is why this is a risk mitigation as well as a scientific issue, which is core to the field of public health management. You have to weigh the risk of what happens if you are wrong. If you don't wear a mask and you are wrong, then it is likely more people get sick and die. If you wear a mask and you are wrong, then harm to you and others is likely very small or nothing (acknowledging that a small number of folks may have legitimate medical issues with a mask and will require reasonable accommodations).

I was at the doctor today for my six month check up.  Right before I left, he got me an appointment at a local pharmacy on Thursday for the Moderna shot.

The Danish study in the Annals of Internal Medicine did not test what has been identified as the major benefit of mask wearing, which is to prevent the infected person from infecting others. It has been reported from early on that masks are primarily to prevent the spread from the mask wearers to others, with a possible small reduction in infection rates to the wearer. The nature of the Danish research is preliminary. Controls were the best they could impose and adherence to test protocols by participants was marginal.

While it is great to drill into this stuff, you have to realize that the folks that really understand the whole body of literature (rather than what you can easily get access to on the internet), in addition to, in-work research projects and clinical trials, are folks at organizations like the CDC. Our knowledge is going to expand over time, but that is what it takes to figure out something like this. In the meantime, we have to decide whether we are going to follow CDC direction, because masks might work, or try hard to find a justification for not following CDC guidance, because we don't want to wear masks.

In science it is body of work that counts. There are frequently competing theories. Making definitive conclusions before the research converges to a common understanding can be a problem. That is why this is a risk mitigation as well as a scientific issue, which is core to the field of public health management. You have to weigh the risk of what happens if you are wrong. If you don't wear a mask and you are wrong, then it is likely more people get sick and die. If you wear a mask and you are wrong, then harm to you and others is likely very small or nothing (acknowledging that a small number of folks may have legitimate medical issues with a mask and will require reasonable accommodations).

Well said...

It is not my responsibility to keep you from catching the flu.  Now, it is my responsibility if I have an illness that is communicable to take precautions as to not spread it.  That would entail keeping away from others, not wearing a mask in public if I am sick.  But I am not the keeper of the world, not do I feel guilt for these actions.

It is not my responsibility to keep you from catching the flu.  Now, it is my responsibility if I have an illness that is communicable to take precautions as to not spread it.  But I am not the keeper of the world, not do I feel guilt for these actions.

I was responding to a discussion on a particular article regarding mask effectiveness. I have not read every post in this thread so I am not sure what positions you have taken. But in light of your comment above, there is enough asymptomatic infection out there that folks cannot tell, with certainty, whether they are infectious, even after having a test since results are not immediate and definitive. So this gets back to a risk issue. Risk is great to others if you are infectious and don't know it. As such, the lowest risk position for society is to assume that you are infected.

We are all responsible for our own ethical decisions. My decision is to error on the side of taking precautions to help others. I guess that means that I am on what you call the "keeper of the world" side of the issue. Wearing a mask and social distancing is easy so I do it.

I've had both shots, still wear a mask and social distance when appropriate, but I socialize freely with friends/relatives who have had their shots and eat out much more often. I still try to avoid strangers and and large gatherings.

So when do I stop being asymptomatic?  I am not going to take the vaccine, so I need to wear a mask for how long to protect others? 

So when do I stop being asymptomatic?  I am not going to take the vaccine, so I need to wear a mask for how long to protect others?

According to the "experts", sometime after the country reaches herd immunity which at this time is TBD.

Since Dr. Fauci thinks we need a minimum of 85% of the population vaccinated (maybe even 90% according to him), we will never reach herd immunity.  But we never discuss that or how we proceed as a country.  That's why that whole concept needs to be throw out and a different approach taken.

Since Dr. Fauci thinks we need a minimum of 85% of the population vaccinated (maybe even 90% according to him), we will never reach herd immunity.  But we never discuss that or how we proceed as a country.  That's why that whole concept needs to be throw out and a different approach taken.

Not going to disagree with your assessment.

I just hope in the next 6 weeks or so that the vaccines I take put me on the favorable side of less risk of dying from this virus.

I did find it interesting that my doctor mentioned nothing about getting the common flu shot to me today.  I understand it is a bit late in the season for it.  I also read that the count of those having flu this year are somewhere in the 50%-70% less than in most other years.  So, is there a chance that this pandemic has created herd immunity to the other common flus that have been going on for I have no idea how many years.

And, what does that mean for the common cold?  Anyone feel like they caught that this year?

I'm just trying to look on the bright side of this pandemic.  Maybe it wiped out the common cold and flu pandemics.  I would be all for that for giving up a year of my life at this stage in my life!

I received my second Pfizer Vaccine two days ago. I didn't really have any side effects other than a slightly sore arm. Maybe a bit more tired, but still did everything I would normally do as far as work goes and working on our master bathroom remodel.

Our daughter, who is a teacher, got her second shot a week or so before me and she was very wiped out from it plus headaches. She missed her next two days of work but is back to normal now. I've heard that younger people have more issues with the second shot and that was the case for her as well as our son who works in a retirement facility. Both kids got the Pfizer.

My wife got her first Moderna vaccine a week ago with no side effects. She gets her second at the end of the month. 4 weeks between shots instead of the 3 weeks for the Pfizer shot.

I read an article two days ago about the lack of flu cases.  They don't really know why.  Some speculate that it is because of masks, hand washing and social distance.  Some speculate that the covid virus is the more "dominate" virus this year and so either blocks or supersedes the flu.  I am not sure we will ever know.  But there are hundreds of strains of both flu and colds, so highly unlikely that this virus has done away with all of them.